which combo is more difficult....

[bishonen]

could anyone here tell me which combo is more difficult, a double triple combo or a triple double combo?

another question, can skaters do more than two combos in LP? If they can do more than two, how come most of the skaters only do two combos in their LP? I know that there is limitation to the number of triple jumps in LP, but is there any limitation to the double jumps? If no, they can do some more triple double combos in LP to increase the difficulty.

i am not a skater, so sorry for these stupid questions.

[susan ba]

i think the the rules say that only eight triple or higher jumps can be counted in the lp. yaguden did 9 at one of last year's competition i think... he wasn't penalized for the 9th one, but he wasn't officially given credit for it either. and i think there is a rule that says you can do a triple jump twice...once by itself and once in combination. i think the laymen's name for that is the zayak rule (after ellan zayak who would do the same triple jumps several times during the program or something like that...not sure)

i don't think there is a rule against doing more than two combos... i think sarah hughes did a 3l/2t combo and then attempted 2 triple/triple combos. i'm guessing that most skaters don't do more than 2 combos because they are not consistent enough to do them as solo jumps...much more in combos. michelle is the only eligible skater that really consistently completes 6 and 7 triples. only a few other skaters are begining to do that (irina, sarah, jennifer kirk etc...)

[scheherazade]

I'm not sure about the rules part of your question, though I could check out an old USFSA rulebook from '96 later if you want. As for the difficulty of the combos, I would think that a double-triple would be more difficult because you don't have as much speed and momentum going into the second jump. No one ever really does that though, because if you're planning a triple-triple or a triple-double and you double the first jump, then you probably aren't going to have the momentum to go into the second jump. Ok, that was redundant...

[bishonen]

thanks susan ba and scheherazade.
I came up with these questions because i saw Tara do the double triple combinations years ago. So I wonder if any skaters can't land triple triple regularly, they may try double triple combos to increase their technical difficulty.

About the number of triples, doubles, and combos in LP. I always thought that 8 triples for men and 7 triples for women (more precise, skaters are allowed to land all 6 types of triple jumps once and repeat two of them if they are in combos. Since women skaters don't do triple axles, they can only land 7 triple jumps). However, I am confused after some men skaters came up with quart jumps. Are those quart jumps counted as part of the 8 triples? As Susan ba said Alexi Yagudin did 9 triples, do the rules have the mandatory deduction for this? Anyway, I am just confused and thank you you guys' help. Scheherazade, don't bother checking the rule out for me. Thank you.

[susan ba]

bishonen... i don't remember seeing tara doing a double triple...but i do remember seeing her do a 2a/1/2l/3s... however, i have seen other skaters do double/triple combos before.

there was no mandatory deduction for yag's 9th triple...but he just didn't get credit for it. he said he just got caught up in the moment and forgot to count ...others say that he did it on purpose to gain a psychological advantage with the judges.

[bishonen]

susan ba...... i think tara did (or tried to land) a double/triple in '96 world. Dick Button said, "She is the only skater attempting a double triple combination." But she fell on the triple jump, so technically "I didn't see her land a double triple jump." Sorry about that. But I heard she did her LP flawless in the qualifing round, so I assume she did land 2/3 in '96. Anyway, Tara is a good skaters, I am not surprised that she did 2a/1/2l/3s. So bad she isn't in amateur competition anymore. I heard Irina was planning to do something like 3/2/2 or 3/3/2 in world, but she failed doing it.

I don't know whether Yagudin doing it (9 triples) on purspose or not, but I think it is hard for skaters counting the number of triples/quart especailly when they mess up their program already.
However, some skaters do have their plan in mind. Like Michelle, she will change her double axle to triple toe if she misses the second triple toe in her triple toe triple toe combination.

[TaraLipinski87]

The double/triple b/c you do an easy double then after that you pull into a much harder triple. The triple/double is hard at first, then relaxing sorta.

[KwanBoy23]

According to the Official USFSA Figure Skaters Guide, skaters can only perform a maximum of 3 combonations, whether they are 2 or 3 or more jump combinations. Anything past that who knows. I've heard Mr. D. Button state that a double/triple is very hard because you need to maintain speed from the double into the triple but someone'a already said that. As for going past the max amount of triples, it does happen. At Nationals, again Mr. Button said that there 'SHOULD' be a mandatory .1 deduction for technical merit, but whether the judges follow that rule or if we can even tell is another story all together.