Walley jump

[iloveskating]

I am confused about this jump. I remember reading several weeks on this board that the walley was the same as 3toe but on an inside edge. That would make it a pick assisted jump. I know I've heard commentators talk about the 3 toe walley. But sw, you said in response to my question my question in another thread this week that the walley is an edge jump, and always a single connecting jump, because it is too hard to do multiple revolutions. I don't doubt you, I'm just confused.

So is there a 3 toe walley that is pick assisted and a single walley that is edge only, or what? Could someone help clarify.

And why isn't the 3 toe walley considered one of the main jumps, why isn;t it done more? Thanks.

[AYS]

A toe walley is just like a toe loop but it takes off from a back inside rather than back outside edge. It is a pretty subtle difference; in this case the edge doesn't change the difficulty for some reason. I don't think it is credited as a different jump from the toe loop, because the two have nearly identical mechanics. So people just do whichever version they favor.

A walley is an edge jump. For CCW jumpers (the majority), you take off from a back right inside edge *with no toe pick assist*, rotate, then land on a back right outside edge.

[ChicaRealidad]

iloveskating -- If you've got the 1999 Nationals on tape, then rewatch Michelle's LP, "Ariane". When she does her 3/3 both DB and Peggy think she's going to do a 3toe loop/3toe loop, but as she jumps in the air for the first jump DB says it's a toe walley not a toe loop.

This year at Skate America when Michelle did the combo it was a 3toe loop/3toe loop. Although he didn't mention it at the time, DB has said that the toe walley is a little more difficult jump than the toe loop and because of the edge it comes off it has to be the first jump in a combo. I think he also said that hardly no one uses the jump anymore, but I don't think he ever said why it had stopped being used.

I think you can tell when Michelle is setting up for the jump whether it's the walley or toe loop. If she doesn't pick it's the walley, if she does, it's the toe loop.

[AYS]

The difference between the toe walley and the toe loop is the edge that the takeoff foot is on before it leaves the ice. Both the toe walley and the toe loop use the toe pick assist. A plain walley uses no toe pick assist (it is an edge jump like a loop or salchow). No one does a triple walley...you generally only see single walleys (has anyone seen people do double walleys?)

The commentators sometimes call it a toe walley (especially Christopher Bowman) if the skater enters the jump with a forward outside 3 turn, switches feet then picks. This entry lends itself to getting onto a back inside edge more than the traditional toe loop entry, a forward inside 3 turn on the takeoff foot to start with - this leaves you on a back outside edge, and would require an actual edge change for the jump to be a toe walley.

However, even though many skaters now use the forward outside 3-turn-change foot entry, they still go off the outside edge, so it is *not* a toe walley. Look closely at Michelle's above-mentioned 3toe/3toe combo from 1999 Nationals: she enters using a left forward outside 3 turn to the left back inside edge, changes to the right foot and takes off. Note the lean of her right foot over to the right side as she enters the jump and lifts off the ice - this is a back outside edge, which defines the jump as a toe loop, not a toe walley. This is pretty much how she always does it.