A new twist on the "Will Michelle be left behind?"

[Deetlebug]

I just had a couple of ideas and didn't want them to get buried. (Besides - I don't start very many new threads anywaaazzz...8-)) Here's what I'm thinking... 1. Has anyone else noticed the tendency this season of the judges to give Michelle higher tech marks than presentation marks? So far this hasn't happened across the board, but it didn't only happen at the Japan Open either. I find it interesting that with the media harping on Michelle needing to "up" her technical difficulty that the judges are sending her a message that her long, highly valued presenation is not packing it's usual punch but her technical difficulty is a-ok! 2. A quote from Lori Nicol a few years back, 1998 I believe, that should give the many fans of Michelle who are starting to get nervous about what the media is saying a little piece of mind.... "Once Michelle sees what she needs to do, she always takes care of it." So besides Michelle herself, who would know her better in this regard than Frank or Lori? So if that's what Lori says, I believe her a lot more over any speculation about Michelle. Hope this helps those of you with jittery nerves. :-)

[Willowdale]

Go DeetleBug!! :-)

[Icare]

Good thoughts, Deetlebug! I have visited some stock message boards, and I happen to know some insiders too. My observation is that posters sometimes are way off! Managements usually steer a very large ship, even though they are capable and they work realy hard, it takes time to change the direction of a large ship. In MK's case, since MK has this outstanding track record, we should believe in her, watch her running her own show. Nevertheless, encouragements and well meant suggestions never hurt.

[Schuyg]

I'm sorry, but this does not cover my jitters. I claim myself to be one of the biggest MK fans, but I am truly worried. For the past two years, everyone has been telling Michelle to up her technical difficulty in the SP and she hasn't. She noticed the beginning of the jumping frenzy with Tara and she only started throwing in the 3toe/3toe every now and then. Now there is Sarah Hughes who is planning two 3/3 combos at Nationals. What does this mean? Well I tell you. It's very sad that figure skating has come to the point where National's champion is determined by whoever outjumps the next, but it is. It is also sad that the judges have been trying to give Michelle a hint for the past year, and she still hasn't gotten it. I think they may want to teach her a lesson going into Worlds. I am truly hoping and praying on my little MK temple that she has introduced a new 3/3 into her repertoire for the Nationals. I'm quit sure that she hasn't done this with the little time between Grand Prix and Nationals, but she is going to regret it if she didn't. And what's this about possibly using Arianne as opposed to the Red Violin. That would be a nother mistake. RV is so complicated and intricate that only a true artist and technician can skate to it. It's here calling piece and distinguishes her from the rest of the group. Hopefully she and Lori and Frank realize this. OK, I think I'm finished. I may get flamed for this, but honestly, it is time for our little princess to step up to the plate and hit a home run. One that will silence all of the critics and once again make us MK fans not afraid to watch the competitions. Hopefully, this time, after Grand Prix, she really got a clue. I'm praying for you Michelle:)

[Jarrett]

Yes, Sarah is PLANNING two triple/triple combos. She has yet to land anything close to that since last year's Nationals, where she landed the 3L/3L. If she lands them great, good for her.(I will admit that I am a SH fan too) If she falls on them, it WILL take away from her overall program. Same thing for Tim G. He plans 3 quads but did that once. He attempts it in every long but has fallen on two of them. To me it really takes away prgram. I would much rather watch Matt Savoie land wonderful and high triples, that are nice and clean.

[Mordecai71]

I am kinda new on this board, but I want to add my thoughts to this. The way I see it is, Michelle know EXACTLY what she has to do to win at nats and worlds. But did anyone consider this? MAYBE she is taking a "skating break" for now...concentrating on school and life more and (just a little) less on skating. Ever since she was 13, she has not had a life outside of skating. Maybe she feels the need for a little rest before preparing for 2002. She herself has said that she does not need to win EVERYthing. I believe in my heart that even if she does not win worlds this year, she will not give up. It juat may not be part of HER overall plan this year. But mark my word...as we get nearer to 2002, she will be back to her old, self-competitve self!

[taf2]

IMO, Michelle has been hitting home runs for the last 6 years. People talk about 3/3's like all it takes is desire to do them. Michelle is not known for really high jumps, just awfully clean ones. The 3toe is her highest jump, which is why she probably chooses to do 3toe/3toe instead of something else. Maybe she is not capable of consistantly doing other 3/3's. All skaters have their individual strengths-Michelle has plently of strengths. So what if she isn't a jumping bean? I would rather watch her than a 100 jumping beans. It's like the controversy over the single jump in the SP. Posters may denigrate the 3toe, but I don't really think skaters in the know (except Roz) think her strategy is bad. Why lose the competition in the SP when you can win it consistantly with a 3toe? I don't think Michelle is pushing herself this year, but why does she have to? Can't she pace herself for the next few years and enjoy college and dating, etc? Whether she wins everything or not is unimportant now. She's got nothing left to prove. I think it's wise of her to take it easy on her body & not get burned out. Maybe we'll see her at the Olympics in 2006.

[KWB]

Has anyone cosidered the fact that TRV is so intricate, that adding another 3/3 could throw her off the music??? I mean, for TRV to work and really be affective Michelle has to hit every note perfectly and with this type of music you can't afford to miss a note. To add more 3/3 combos to TRV, Michelle would have to step above her normal speed and maybe do a little rechoreographing. Who knows, maybe she is practicing all of this in preparation for Worlds. With Arianne, Michelle has little more room to breathe, in which she could add more 3/3 combos and not have to step up the speed as much, and considering Nationals will be a little easier than Worlds, it does make sense that she might use Arianne for Natioals and unveil an even more exciting and intricate TRV at W#orld. However, OTOH, the down side is that she will not have the luxury of having competed with a revised TRV in competiion before Worlds. Anyhoo, no matter what Michelle desides to do, I'm with her all the way.

[XPEG]

In my opinion, Red Violin is a great program. It's dramatic and mature and filled with wonderful jumps and moves. If Michelle skates this program clean, with all it's many moods, I think she'll win. Didn't she place first with it at the GPF? Heck, at SA one judge was so wowed by it he gave her a 6.0, even with a fall. Now about this SP jump thing. I know that Michelle is doing an easier jump than everybody wants her to do. But tell me, when was the last time Michelle skated a clean SP and didn't place first? Why, even in Nagano she was in first after the SP. At the GPF, she also won the SP.

[Scout]

ITA, taf2! Obviously, Michelle and Frank are aware of the criticism over her SP solo jump. So if they aren't changing it, then I have to assume they have their reasons. In Brennan's 2/4/98 article about Michelle, Frank and Lori were quoted as saying they had a plan. "We know where we want to go in four years.", Nichol said. "How are we going to get there? Not all at once." I think that quote says it all. They know what they are doing and what others are doing and what Michelle needs to do to stay on top. That is not to say that they are perfect and can't make errors in judgment, but I'd bet on them over the long haul. I'm getting excited (and nervous) about Nationals. Go Michelle!!! Suzanne

[Googoo]

I don't think it would be wise for MK to re-vamp the LP and add another 3/3 combo this season. I mean is there even time for that? That was a really good point that some of you Kwansters bought up re the SP and how MK has always been in 1st with the easier single jump!

[DianeO]

I agree Googoo! The SP comment is a good point! A lot of people keep saying she needs to add a flip or some other more difficult jump, but she hasn't finished less than first with a clean SP in I don't know how long. I think it is because the judges do recognize that the overall quality of ALL her technical elements (not just jumps) are superior to the other ladies. As long as Michelle continues to skate consistently well this season, I'm not worried. I don't think there is a rush to add 3/3s *this season*. She has plenty of time before the Olympics to do that :)

[Karin]

OK...don't get me wrong...of course I'm still supporting MK 100%...but I honestly don't "care" as much about the upcoming competition results...not as much as I was at the beginning of the season... (Weird!!!...) Anywayz...like I said in the other thread...may be it will help MK instead of "hurt" her if she doesn't win Nationals and Worlds??? ...JMO...and sorta a question... Actually I would kinda like to see Sarah win Nationals and for Irina to win Worlds...because SH and IS are also my favourite skaters... IMO I think it would be even more brilliant if MK comes back next season with more technical difficulty and win the US and world title...going into the next season's Olympics gloriously!!!...My only wish at this time is that MK can win the 2002 Olympic gold medal!!!... (please don't misunderstand me...MK is still my hero and the 1 skater I support all the way!!!) :-)

[Rene]

Of course we all know anything can happen, but...I don't believe that Michelle will be sent to the Worlds anything less than a National Champion. She would really have to melt down. Even if Sarah does 2 3/3 combos. Michelle "gets" the hints. She knows what she's doing and she knows what needs to be done. She just may not wish to act upon them at this time, for many reasons. I think that whatever works for her right now is what she's going to do. I don't think it's anything much more complicated than that. But...it's fun to talk about anyway!

[chippy4mk]

Yeah, it is fun to talk about it! Isn't it what the forum for? I love Michelle, in my heart she is always the BEST. But judges are screwy these days. They obviously award quad or 3/3 jumps - good examples are T.Goebel, Irina(although her landings were dead stop). But then again they are also generous to "pretty face" who has good presence on ice even though her jump technics are not solid - like Maira B's shaky landing, and Nam who did not even have 3 lutz (but awarded silver at last Nat'l). Yes, there is no need that Michelle wins every competition she enters. And I also believe Michelle and Frank's approach(their focus is a long range,2002) is very logical and healthy one. BUT big question is ; do judges look at her favorably or unfovorably after not attempting upping her jumps this year? There is always this "halo effect" on current champion or whoever has the most difficult 3/3 combo. Anyway, what I am concerned is that judges are so fickle. And FS is such a subjective sports..... It is tough to stay on top..... Michelle must present 3/3 with super clean programs to impress judges that she is truly on top of the game.

[samacc]

Michelle will always be the winner for me, regardless if she will loose or win the nat'l or worlds. I agree that this stage she is on that "experimental" basis of jungling skating and school, for that alone i take my hat off for her doing that..We have to remind ourselves that she is just trying to live a normal live even if she knew herself that this is impossible bec. of her status, she is a very intelligent and focus individual no matter what i know she is determine to be there in the 2002 olympics, her perception of skating is difft. from other skaters she has the LOVE of skating going on in her and it just gives me pleasure to see her do her best and see the JOY when she is out there doing it. So let it rest,those 3jumps/3toe.. we know OUR michelle and she will always try to give the very best of herself.And if it short of other peoples expectation then tough! bec. you did not get what michelle said before in the interview with jay leno about winning the silver, that she didnt loose at all she has Won! because she was out there doing what she love to do and that is skating! No matter what she will always be no.1.

[hop]

OK fellow MK fans, I have a couple of dumb questions. First of all, can I still catch a repeat of the Japan Open on a cable station? Second, when are the Nationals and on what TV network? Third, what are the March dates for the Worlds and on what TV network? I've been a skating fan (both figure and hockey) for many years, and yes, shame on me for not knowing the dates of the big competitions this year. MK is the best figure skater in the world - a complete package, and no one else can match her. She may not win everything this year, but so what. It doesn't matter to me if she wins gold or nothing; as long as she loves to skate, I'll be watching her. hop

[kwantasy]

I think that Michelle got the *hint* a very long time ago. She has said before that she knows the technical aspect of the sport is increasing. Also, she's supposedly training harder jump combos and triple axels. Now, after the GPF, maybe she will actually put it into her long programs. If she's not ready to put them in, at least she's training them for the next season and beyond. However, in regards to the SP, I don't think she'll do a flip unless a)she is having trouble with the triple toe(which is probably her most consistent jump) or b)she gets 2nd maybe 3rd in the SP with clean jumps, spins, etc. which I don't think will happen this year(or hopefully never).

[eilaram]

Here is Heather's tv schedule. <A HREF=http://onramp.uscom.com/~alaynew/sch.htm >http://onramp.uscom.com/~alaynew/sch.htm </A>

[SJB]

Remember that Michelle was injured for part of 97 and nearly all of 98, in such a way that she could not do the 3/3 with which she was most comfortable, and suddenly had to try to come up with a new one. And she did try, even in the short time she had. Remember her practicing the 3 loop/3 loop, to see if there were other 3/3 combos that she could put in, since anything with a 3 toe was out? Presumably she didn't get consistent enough with that combo to use it in 98. Also, recall that, while the 3 toe was the jump that really aggravated her injury, she also had pain on the 3 sal and 2 axel. So that cuts out even more possible 3/3's. Also, Michelle seems to be a better toe jumper than edge jumper, possibly one reason she didn't get good enough at 3/3's that included loops. Then, in 99, Tara's gone and there's no immediate need to get a second 3/3, since she was back to doing the 3 toe/3 toe, and no one else was a really serious challenge. She has, however, been seen practicing different 3/3s and the 3 axle all this time, so she was not resting on her laurels, but working to improve. And I'm confident that when she and Frank determine that the time is right, we will see more jump difficulty from Michelle. And, I have to agree, since Michelle has won every SP she skated clean since the 95 Worlds (where she did a 3 flip, BTW) except the Ultimate Four 98, in which she placed second in the SP after Kristi Y. (no shame in that! and thank you Brian), there is no immediate hurry to switch to the 3 flip. She and Frank will do so when the decision is strategically right.

[kwanette]

I don't care how much I like Sarah, good kid, or how much Irina has improved...I will root for Michelle to win until she stops competing in the eligible ranks.Call me narrow-minded, a one-skater woman, whatever...Michelle has my heart and loyalty for as long as she is around. I hope Sarah does well at Worlds...assuming she goes..because I always want the US to send three competitors to OLY and Worlds....But root for anyone else? Not this kwan0phile!

[Crazyglue]

Hey Kwanette, I can't agree with you more... no matter how many awesome skaters are out there, and no matter how much i like them, i'll always want Michelle to win... I don't think you're narrow-minded at all... Even though i like SH, Sasha, Irina, and others, Michelle will be the one i'm rooting for to win---

[GinnySmith]

DeetleBug--Thanks for this post. I agree with you 100% and just about every other poster. Of course, I have to add my 2 cents... As Kwanette stated, I always want Michelle to win and will always root for her. However, I don't expect her to take gold all of the time, especially with so much going on in her life right now. Do I like other skaters? Yes. Do I want Michelle to win? Of course... Finally, XPEG pointed out that the Red Violin is a great program. I totally agree. Michelle almost, but not quite, skated it to it's full potential at Skate America. It was awesome. The music, the speed, the spark, the attitude, the intricacy of the foot work, the height, speed and coverage of the ice on the triple-triple..Yikes! Michelle has the potential to transform this program into one of her magical, unforgettable skates, aka, 1996 Worlds and the 1998 Nationals. I'm keeping my fingers crossed (and trying to find my Seasame Chicken recipe to post just in case!!!) that this happens at either the 2000 Nationals or Worlds.....

[sw10025a]

Regarding the relative height of Michelle's jumps, has anyone considered the fact that MK doesn't do huge jumps might actually be helpful? I have heard several skaters say that with combinations, you don't want to get a lot of height, at least on the first jump. What you want out of the first jump is speed and flow to help you execute the second jump. Going up higher might be impressive, but it also cuts down on your speed and momentum coming out of the jump. The skater is using energy and momentum to get altitude that might otherwise be used on the second jump. Second, the concept of pacing oneself seems to have been lost a little in all this discussion. And I'm not talking about pacing oneself within the context of a program, but over the whole season. Michelle could wear herself out, exhaust herself mentally and physically and make herself black and blue with bruises in a desperate attempt to have 2 3-3 combos of her own for nationals. And she could completely run out of gas for worlds in the process. Its like horse racing: a good trainer won't run a horse in event after event after event. They need rest periods between races, and quite frankly, trainers try to train the horses so that they peak for the important races. You don't train as hard for the Florida Derby as you do for the Kentucky Derby a couple of weeks later. Barring a major catastrophe, Michelle can probably win Nationals with very little difficulty. Irina does not have that luxury. The jump combos she did at GPF were very impressive and difficult, but they also probably required a great deal of hard work and training. She also has Europeans coming up this week, where she will meet much of her major competition and where she *must* perform well in order to soundly trounce them, or risk having the judges at worlds wonder if it was a one time fluke performance. At worlds, there will be a lot more at stake and a lot more to lose. There won't be the luxury of knowing you can't fall below second. In 93, Kerrigan fell from first to fifth place after the LP. A high risk strategy when you have nothing to lose is one thing, but that same strategy when you have nerves, when there is so much more to be gained or to be lost, is another -- a mistake or failure to execute could topple you right off the podium. And quite frankly, barring significant problems, she needs both those combos to top Kwan.

[Lara F]

Does Michelle need the flip in the SP at Worlds? Most likely not in order to place in the top three (though I have to say that I'll be pretty surprised if she places first - she just barely beat Irina in that portion of the GPF). However, the flip *would* give a very favorable impression that might carry on to the LP, even if Michelle has no new triple/triple combinations. It would show that she *is* pushing herself and listening to her critics. Besides, she's almost certainly going to need it in the future so why on earth wait? Especially if this is supposed to be an experimental year where Michelle doesn't have to win everything anyways. She doesn't have that much to lose IMO. Lara Michele :-)

[Lara F]

I accidentally hit submit while changing the subject header LOL.